Nicodemus, Moses, and the Presidents Smith

By: J. Stapley - March 09, 2005

One of the evanescent institutions of graduate school was Man-Books. Man-Books was intended to be a weekly gathering of three people (Steve, Josh – my devout Catholic friend – and myself) where we would delve into sundry texts and be edified. We met once (it was time that lacked more than volition). On that singular meeting at the tri-chi we delved into the pseudepigraphal Gospel of Nicodemus. It was not until a couple months ago that several aspects of this book came flooding back.

First, my text comes from The Lost Books of the Bible and the Forgotten Books of Eden, World Bible Publishers. 1927 (still sold in Barnes & Noble). Kudos to anyone who can verify that the cool quote on the title page attributed to “Dr. Talmage” is that of our very own.

In the text there are several things that I want to note:

The Pharisees while enquiring about Jesus’ assent state that they know Enoch was translated, but that the burial place of Moses is known (12:10).

Jesus descends into Hell (Hades in the Gospel Link text) and among other things grabs Adam and the other prophets and takes them up to paradise where Enoch and Elijah (15:3) are waiting. Interestingly the prophets (that were in Hell) are like, “who are these jokers?” and it is explained that these old timers never tasted death. Moreover Elijah is referred to as both Elijah and Elias.

However, the Bible Dictionary explains about Moses:

In company with Elijah, he came to the Mount of Transfiguration and bestowed keys of the priesthood upon Peter, James, and John. From this event, which occurred before the resurrection of Jesus, we understand that Moses was a translated being, and had not died as reported in Deut. 34 (Alma 45: 19). It was necessary that he be translated, in order to have a body of flesh and bones at the time of the transfiguration, since the resurrection had not yet taken place. Had he been a spirit only, he could not have performed the work on the mount of giving the keys to the mortal Peter, James, and John.

Maybe the Gospel of Nicodemus was right though. From D&C 138 we have a revelation of what was going on in the spirit world (AKA Hell) when the Lord went down for his visit. President Smith lists all those who were gathered together in congregational anticipation, among whom were (emphasis added):

41 Noah, who gave warning of the flood; Shem, the great high priest; Abraham, the father of the faithful; Isaac, Jacob, and Moses, the great glaw-giver of Israel;…

45 Elias, who was with Moses on the Mount of Transfiguration;…

But from Joseph Smith we have:

WOJS pg.9
The Priesthood is everlasting. The Savior, Moses, & Elias—gave the Keys to Peter, James & John on the Mount when they were transfigured before him. The Priesthood is everlasting, without beginning of days or end of years, without Father, Mother &c,—

So…any ideas?

7 Comments

  1. J,
    I can only assume that they were just there as part of the organization of the work for the dead who needed to hear the gospel. The verse does say that he was organizing the righteous for this purpose, and there was no reason that he couldn’t be part of that. I’m not sure if 47 is implying that perhaps Elijah was there, and that this began his ministry for the dead, in which we participate in the Spirit of Elijah, giving credit to the more radical idea of Elijah (a little late for that post) that his spirit as a spirit might be running around inspiring people.
    The reason I think this is the more reasonable explanation is Alma 45:19, which specifically says that the scripture says that the Lord “took Moses unto himself.” I have no idea why this verse is in parentheses in the bible dictionary rather than being the primary evidence given of his having been translated.
    This might however, make us reconsider the idea that the Lord took Moses before he entered the promised land as a punishment for striking the rock, or at lesat the degree to which God was really angry at him. Entering the promised land might have been a great thing, but translation isn’t so shabby either. Perhaps Moses was taken up because God had already shown Moses that he was too prone to displays of his own importance, and he didn’t want to tempt him to do so on the actual occasion fo entering the land.

    Comment by S. Hancock — 3/9/2005 @ 1:03 am

  2. J.,

    This only becomes a question if you assume resurrected or translated bodies cannot visit the spirit world. I don’t know of anything to back that assumption. In fact we know spirits can visit us embodied folks here. Plus the Father had a body during all of our intereactions with him in the pre-mortal realms. So if this is the case what is the issue with and embodied Moses preaching in the spirit world?

    Comment by Geoff Johnston — 3/9/2005 @ 3:08 pm

  3. I guess I see a difficulty in those interpretations of the text because of the way he dictated the revelation:

    12 And there were gathered together in one place an innumerable company of the spirits of the just, who had been faithful in the testimony of Jesus while they lived in mortality;

    13 And who had offered sacrifice in the similitude of the great sacrifice of the Son of God, and had suffered tribulation in their Redeemer’s name.

    14 All these had departed the mortal life, firm in the hope of a glorious resurrection, through the grace of God the Father and his Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ.

    Then later:

    36 Thus was it made known that our Redeemer spent his time during his sojourn in the world of spirits, instructing and preparing the faithful spirits of the prophets who had testified of him in the flesh;

    37 That they might carry the message of redemption unto all the dead, unto whom he could not go personally, because of their rebellion and transgression, that they through the ministration of his servants might also hear his words.

    38 Among the great and mighty ones who were assembled in this vast congregation of the righteous were…

    He then goes on to list all the great prophets including Moses and Elias.

    Comment by J. Stapley — 3/9/2005 @ 3:31 pm

  4. J,
    I tend to red this as a text in the way I would any text. That is, language is inherently inaccurate. That is, he does refer to the company as spirits, but that is much easier than saying an innumerable company of spirits plus a few people like Moses that had bodies. It’s expscially convenient because Moses did have a spirit, whether or not he had a body. Basically, I don;t know to what degree the words here are intended to be that precise in stating that absolutely everyone in the company was a spirit only.

    Comment by Steve H — 3/9/2005 @ 4:01 pm

  5. I guess I can buy into that…but you’ll notice that Enoch wasn’t listed 😉

    Comment by J. Stapley — 3/9/2005 @ 4:04 pm

  6. Interestingly, President Smith seems kind of ambivalent in his description of the event, giving what seems to be an allusion to the fullness of the Priesthood. From Answers to Gospel Questions vol. 2 pg 121:

    Moses and Elias at the Transfiguration
    Question: “What was the purpose of the mission of Moses and Elias at the transfiguration of the Savior, when he took Peter, James, and John with him upon the mountain?”

    Answer: It is very apparent that this was a sacred mission which in all of its particulars was not revealed to the world. The only mention of the purpose of that visitation is given by Luke to the effect that Moses and Elias spoke to Jesus in relation to his death which should be accomplished at Jerusalem. The questions put to Jesus by the apostles as they descended from the mountain infer that there was something said in relation to the restoration of all things before the second coming of the Lord. However, they were placed under a strict command not to reveal what had taken place, even to their associates, until after the Savior’s resurrection. It is quite evident that much that took place was of such a sacred nature that it was not to be revealed to the world.

    PETER’S TESTIMONY
    Peter in later years bore witness to the significance of this heavenly vision as a testimony of the divinity of Jesus Christ, in the following words:

    For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

    For he received from God the Father honor and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

    And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.

    We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

    Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

    For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. (2 Peter 1:16-21.)

    It seems apparent that while on the mount these three apostles received an endowment and a commission to act as a presidency in the Church after the crucifixion of our Lord. The Lord revealed to the Prophet Joseph Smith the following in relation to this spiritual manifestation:

    [He then gives the WOJS quote from above]

    Comment by J. Stapley — 3/9/2005 @ 5:28 pm

  7. I have that book, too. I think I bought it at the B. Dalton at University Mall. Chances are, the Talmage quoted is Thomas Dewitt Talmage, a prominent American Presbyterian minister who was well known for his rhetorical skills.

    Online sites with other well known early christian scriptures are at Early Christian Writings (though the dates they provide are ridiculously early, probably to cut down on hate mail from Bible literalists) and comparative-religion.com.

    Incidentally, to say that the authorship attributions of the apocryphal New Testament books are downright silly is only to say that they are slightly less plausible than the attributions traditionally given to the canonical texts. And if you begin to read through very many of of the apocryphal texts, you’ll notice that there are so very many divergent views about who Christ was and how he fit into the puzzle that there’s something in them for every religion to cherish as evidence that their church practices the original, true Christianity.

    Comment by Arturo Toscanini — 3/10/2005 @ 12:46 am

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